================================================ Subject: Odp: RE: Odp: RE: NCR/ RR: CAPPFW site From: "Jackson Crawford" To: Date: Mon 7 May 2001 20:40:35 -0500 ================================================ Oh, I'm very much all in favor of challenging what others claim to be real - things like deities, laws, governments, etc. As good ol' Cliff used to put it; "If I can't see it, hear it, smell it, taste it, or touch it, it ain't real!" And 'tis but a matter o' course that we must escape reality. Part of what separates us from the lower animals is our ability to know what is real, to noetically engender what is not, and to separate, or even more complex, NOT separate, one from another. I'll continue with this discussion tomorrow. Jackson Wade Crawford - The Raven of Texas/ Corvvs Texanis/ Kruk Teksasu International Director, Corvist Association for the Preservation and Perpetuation of Free Will -----Original Message----- From: Creed - 7M3 - Live [mailto:creed7m3live@columbus.rr.com] Sent: Monday, May 07, 2001 5:13 PM To: Jackson Crawford Cc: CreedList Subject: Re: Odp: RE: NCR/ RR: CAPPFW site As long as you aren't against challenging what is claimed to be real. I can go for it. But I have to have my escape from established reality, on occasion. Jackson Crawford wrote: > We're definitely not against imagination - by realism, we mean that we >acknowledge what is and what is not real, something that a great many people >have difficulty doing. I support all kinds of imagining and dreaming and >whatnot, but I think it important that we know what is real and what is >engendered purely by the mind, whether ours or an other's. > Thanks as always for your input JIm. And what an appropriate quote that >that was at the bottom! > >Jackson Wade Crawford - The Raven of Texas/ Corvvs Texanis/ Kruk Teksasu >International Director, Corvist Association for the Preservation and >Perpetuation of Free Will > >-----Original Message----- >From: Creed - 7M3 - Live [mailto:creed7m3live@columbus.rr.com] >Sent: Sunday, May 06, 2001 9:13 PM >To: Jackson Crawford >Cc: CREED-DISCUSS@WINDUPLIST.COM >Subject: Re: NCR/ RR: CAPPFW site > >Qualities of belief; >/Spontaneity/ - acting from native feeling, proneness, or temperament, >without constraint or external force. >/Free Will/ - The power asserted of moral beings of willing or choosing >without the restraints of physical or absolute necessity. >/Nepenthe/ - A drug used by the ancients to give relief from pain and >sorrow; -- by some supposed to have been opium or hasheesh. > Hence, anything soothing and comforting. (I take it that you are >talking about anything soothing or comforting.) >/Doubt/ - To hesitate in belief; to be undecided as to the truth of the >negative or the affirmative proposition; to b e undetermined. >/Individualism/ - the theory or practice of maintaining the >independence of individual initiative, action, and interests, as in > industrial organization or in government. >/Realism/ - Fidelity to nature or to real life; representation without >idealization, and making no appeal to the imagination; adherence to the >actual fact. >/Pragmatism/ - The quality or state of being pragmatic (Philosophical; >dealing with causes, reasons, and effects,rather than with details and circumstances;) -; in literature, the >pragmatic, or philosophical, method. > >-- >Extraordinary claims demand extraordinary proof. There are many examples of >outsiders who eventually overthrew entrenched scientific orthodoxies, but >they prevailed with irrefutable data. More often, egregious findings that >contradict well-established research turn out to be artifacts. I have >argued that accepting psychic powers, reincarnation, "cosmic conciousness," >and the like, would entail fundamental revisions of the foundations of >neuroscience. Before abandoning materialist theories of mind that have paid >handsome dividends, we should insist on better evidence for psi phenomena >than presently exists, especially when neurology and psychology themselves >offer more plausible alternatives. >- Barry L. Beyerstein, "The Brain and Conciousness: Implications for Psi > Phenomena", The Skeptical Inquirer, Vol. XII No. 2, ppg. 163-171 > -- We rarely find anyone who can say he has lived a happy life, and who, content with his life, can retire from the world like a satisfied guest. -- Quintus Horatius Flaccus (Horace) To unsubscribe or change your preferences for the Creed-Discuss list, visit: http://www.winduplist.com/ls/discuss/form.asp